anna (ID=6) (Oct 16, 2001 8:44:15 AM)
good morning!
dr.j (ID=7) (Oct 16, 2001 8:50:39 AM)
(This user has entered CAPD: From the Heart) (IP = 12.79.106.47)
dr.j (ID=7) (Oct 16, 2001 8:51:12 AM)
good morning anna, and how are you this am?
anna (ID=6) (Oct 16, 2001 8:51:38 AM)
eager! how are you?
dr.j (ID=7) (Oct 16, 2001 8:52:39 AM)
fine thank you. I like your notes sort of a nice pick up early in the am.
anna (ID=6) (Oct 16, 2001 8:53:04 AM)
i really like the apd simulation!
dr.j (ID=7) (Oct 16, 2001 8:53:55 AM)
Thank you. I'm glad you liked it and I hope it was helpful in providing a better understanding of APD. Our ultimate goal with the simulation is to get it in an audioform.
anna (ID=6) (Oct 16, 2001 8:55:16 AM)
it's the first actually helpful article i've found. my problem is that since my stroke everything is slowed down. more...
dr.j (ID=7) (Oct 16, 2001 8:57:02 AM)
I understand. Since the stroke, do you find yourself having problems processing auditory information? Is your concern/interest in APD about you or do you have a child with APD? (If you don't mind my asking?)
anna (ID=6) (Oct 16, 2001 8:57:11 AM)
everything seems to work as usual, but it takes me forever to do anything....that includes apd.
anna (ID=6) (Oct 16, 2001 8:57:31 AM)
i'm the one with apd.
dr.j (ID=7) (Oct 16, 2001 8:58:38 AM)
I had a feeling it is personal. Do you know about dolfrog's APD adult email list group (sort of a support group, email discussions, more personal than on APD, but general.
anna (ID=6) (Oct 16, 2001 8:59:42 AM)
my hearing is within normal ranges. i still enjoy music......but the spoken word is gibberish to my mind.
anna (ID=6) (Oct 16, 2001 9:01:06 AM)
i think i am. it's the adult apd list serve?
dr.j (ID=7) (Oct 16, 2001 9:01:27 AM)
Years, years, years ago (around the 1950s and 1960s) APD was originally recognized in adults and they referred to it as "cortical deafness." THe people had normal hearing but, because of some "injury or insult" to the brain, the parts of the brain responsible for processing what they heard was "messed up." (Sorry to use the word "messed up" but that may be a good way to describe it.
dr.j (ID=7) (Oct 16, 2001 9:01:59 AM)
Yes, it's called OldAPDers I think. dolfrog = graeme from England.
anna (ID=6) (Oct 16, 2001 9:02:39 AM)
quickly, before the others arrive, is there any literature about stroke and apd?
dr.j (ID=7) (Oct 16, 2001 9:04:43 AM)
Yes. BUt, most of what I can think of is technical and most is related to diagnosis of (old name CAPD) APD in adults with strokes or other brain injuries/insults to different parts of the brain. I would like to ask you a question, though, if you don't mind that may help me better point you in the right direction to learn and understand more of your communication problems. Do you mind if I ask a bit about your stroke?
anna (ID=6) (Oct 16, 2001 9:05:36 AM)
i'm glad you're familiar with this condition in adults. not at all.....shoot!
cherrie (ID=8) (Oct 16, 2001 9:06:15 AM)
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dr.j (ID=7) (Oct 16, 2001 9:06:44 AM)
It would help me better understand YOU and your concerns and point you in the right direction to learn more If you wouldn't mind telling me what you know of in what part of your brain was the stroke?
dr.j (ID=7) (Oct 16, 2001 9:06:59 AM)
good morning cherrie. How are you this am?
pisi (ID=9) (Oct 16, 2001 9:07:05 AM)
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dr.j (ID=7) (Oct 16, 2001 9:07:21 AM)
good morning pisi, how are you this am?
cherrie (ID=8) (Oct 16, 2001 9:07:35 AM)
hi
pisi (ID=9) (Oct 16, 2001 9:07:44 AM)
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pisi (ID=10) (Oct 16, 2001 9:07:55 AM)
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anna (ID=6) (Oct 16, 2001 9:08:05 AM)
no one ever told me what part of my brain was affected.
dr.j (ID=7) (Oct 16, 2001 9:08:11 AM)
good bye pisi and hello again. Hope you're connection with the chat is ok.
dr.j (ID=7) (Oct 16, 2001 9:08:42 AM)
But you were told you had a stroke?
anna (ID=6) (Oct 16, 2001 9:09:13 AM)
yes, and i almost died from it.
cherrie (ID=8) (Oct 16, 2001 9:09:28 AM)
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cherrie (ID=8) (Oct 16, 2001 9:09:28 AM)
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dr.j (ID=7) (Oct 16, 2001 9:09:42 AM)
Anna, so you can understand why I ask. Different parts of the brain deal with different processes related to auditory information and with language. This is why I am asking.
dr.j (ID=7) (Oct 16, 2001 9:10:36 AM)
ALso, I understand how serious a stroke can be both as a professional who has worked in a hospital/rehab center and personnally since two members of my family have had strokes.
cherrie (ID=8) (Oct 16, 2001 9:11:19 AM)
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anna (ID=6) (Oct 16, 2001 9:11:55 AM)
i don't know what to say now. yes, the rehab in annapolis.....they gave up on me.
dr.j (ID=7) (Oct 16, 2001 9:12:29 AM)
One thing that may be worthwhile for you is to find out from one of your doctors or from any rehab. professionals with whom you are working or have worked what areas/regions of your brain were affected by the stroke. THis may better help you understand what's happening with you.
cherrie (ID=11) (Oct 16, 2001 9:13:02 AM)
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cherrie (ID=11) (Oct 16, 2001 9:13:20 AM)
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cherrie (ID=11) (Oct 16, 2001 9:13:20 AM)
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cherrie (ID=11) (Oct 16, 2001 9:13:27 AM)
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dr.j (ID=7) (Oct 16, 2001 9:13:29 AM)
Cherrie, are you also having connectivity problems? That's usually MY problem
anna (ID=6) (Oct 16, 2001 9:14:23 AM)
the most helpful they told me was that it was called apd......at least then i could look for more information about it.
pisi (ID=10) (Oct 16, 2001 9:14:25 AM)
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anna (ID=6) (Oct 16, 2001 9:15:44 AM)
yes, i'll ask them about it, but it's been more than a year since i've seen any doctors.
anna (ID=6) (Oct 16, 2001 9:17:10 AM)
dr. j, do you ever accept any new patients in dc?
dr.j (ID=7) (Oct 16, 2001 9:17:38 AM)
No, Anna, the most helpful was NOT giving a name to your symptoms because you are in a very different group than the typical APD person. APD is usually a disorder due to some dysfunctioning of the central nervous system. However, in your case, your auditory processing difficulties may not be primary but may be secondary to damage to some areas of the brain due to the stroke and it would be VERY important to know what areas of the brain were affected so that you can know what to expect in terms of how to remediate and what to do to overcome and live with the problem.
dr.j (ID=7) (Oct 16, 2001 9:18:35 AM)
Anna, yes I accept new clients (I like to refer to people as clients rather than the medical model seeing them as patients) in my office in DC.
dr.j (ID=7) (Oct 16, 2001 9:19:20 AM)
Anna, it's ok that its been over a year. THe stroke affected some parts of your central nervous system and you should have a complete understanding of YOUR brain and your body.
anna (ID=6) (Oct 16, 2001 9:20:17 AM)
well, how do they determine the part of the brain it was? what kind of test is it?
anna (ID=6) (Oct 16, 2001 9:20:51 AM)
actually, my stroke was in may '98.
dr.j (ID=7) (Oct 16, 2001 9:21:05 AM)
Usually an MRI is done, but otherwise they could do CAT or CT scans. Sometimes it's an angiogram (not sure of the spelling).
anna (ID=6) (Oct 16, 2001 9:22:10 AM)
yes, i had both......but i was never told any of the details.
dr.j (ID=7) (Oct 16, 2001 9:22:17 AM)
The best part of the date (May 1998) is now to see that it is about 3-1/2 years post. Usually there is some spontaneous recovery within the first 6 months to 1 year after a stroke.
dr.j (ID=7) (Oct 16, 2001 9:22:38 AM)
Anna, you have the right to know, it's your body it's your brain.
dr.j (ID=7) (Oct 16, 2001 9:22:56 AM)
FOr example, some reasons I was asking........
anna (ID=6) (Oct 16, 2001 9:23:31 AM)
yes, i know.....so it seems i'm stuck here now.
anna (ID=6) (Oct 16, 2001 9:25:09 AM)
did you ever get my email? it was sent two weeks+ ago.
dr.j (ID=7) (Oct 16, 2001 9:25:11 AM)
One area of the brain often affected by a stroke involves the motor areas of speaking (as well as other motor areas). THis causes a problem in communication not being able to form the sounds (speech sounds/letters) so that the person so affected has slurred speech and unclear speech. In contrast, a different part of the brain is involved in putting words together to form a message. Reason for bringing this example up is a person who has problems with verbally expressing what he/she wants to say after a stroke needs very different rehabilitation if the problem is motor area vs. expressive language area.
anna (ID=6) (Oct 16, 2001 9:27:10 AM)
yes, my speech is slurred......i'm trying to improve it by doing tongue twisters.
dr.j2 (ID=12) (Oct 16, 2001 9:28:28 AM)
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dr.j (ID=7) (Oct 16, 2001 9:29:02 AM)
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dr.j2 (ID=12) (Oct 16, 2001 9:29:11 AM)
Sorry anna, this will happen from time to time. My ISP often disconnects me without warning. BUsy circuits. BUt I'll always come back.
dr.j2 (ID=12) (Oct 16, 2001 9:29:30 AM)
(This user is now known as dr.j)
anna (ID=6) (Oct 16, 2001 9:29:51 AM)
and my hands are weak, so my handwriting is off. yes, speech and handwriting are linked to apd.
dr.j (ID=12) (Oct 16, 2001 9:30:42 AM)
I was typing to you that about 2 weeks ago, for no known reason, my email service crashed and I lost around 100 messages. Anyway, please if you saved your email or if you want to email me again, send it again as it was fixed. drj@ncapd.org
anna (ID=6) (Oct 16, 2001 9:31:04 AM)
dr. j2, who are you? do you mind if i ask?
anna (ID=6) (Oct 16, 2001 9:32:09 AM)
yes, i saved it. i'll resend it right after this chat.
dr.j (ID=12) (Oct 16, 2001 9:32:10 AM)
COuld be, in your case, it would be very important to know what parts of your brain were affected by the stroke to see if the problems you experience are separate but related to the same underlying brain defect or if the problems are one primary disorder, like apd affecting everything else.
dr.j (ID=12) (Oct 16, 2001 9:32:16 AM)
Yes, please resend it.
dr.j (ID=12) (Oct 16, 2001 9:33:15 AM)
Oh, as for dr.j2.....when I got kicked out, the chat did not delete the dr.j "character" so I could not get back in as dr.j, so I use dr.j2 until the chat clears the dr.j.....it's just a technical thing.
anna (ID=6) (Oct 16, 2001 9:33:39 AM)
lol, okay.
dr.j (ID=12) (Oct 16, 2001 9:34:45 AM)
FOr example, you said your handwriting is affected, as is your speech. I would assume you mean since the stroke? Right?
anna (ID=6) (Oct 16, 2001 9:35:43 AM)
the core problem seems to be an overall slowdown of everything......otherwise, everything is normal.
anna (ID=6) (Oct 16, 2001 9:36:12 AM)
yes, since the stroke.
dr.j (ID=12) (Oct 16, 2001 9:36:53 AM)
Is the problem in producing the words (speech) and producing the writing or is the problem thinking of the words to say or to write?
anna (ID=6) (Oct 16, 2001 9:40:26 AM)
well, at first just finding the right words was difficult, but now it seems to be okay......then again...it still takes time to find them, but they do come.
dr.j (ID=12) (Oct 16, 2001 9:42:03 AM)
I would like to ask another question if you don't mind. WHat problems do you notice in understanding people when THEY speak or in "hearing" (yes I know you have normal hearing, but in hearing or listening behavior?)
Mary (ID=13) (Oct 16, 2001 9:44:59 AM)
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dr.j (ID=12) (Oct 16, 2001 9:45:32 AM)
Good morning mary. How are you this am?
anna (ID=6) (Oct 16, 2001 9:45:51 AM)
when people speak normally, my understanding is zero. but if each word is said verrrrry slowly and distinctly, i can pretty much understand......just almost.
Mari (ID=14) (Oct 16, 2001 9:45:53 AM)
(This user has entered CAPD: From the Heart) (IP = 24.181.150.230)
dr.j (ID=12) (Oct 16, 2001 9:46:14 AM)
good morning mari and how are YOU this am?
Mari (ID=14) (Oct 16, 2001 9:46:50 AM)
IHi Dr. J.--there's only 1 Mary--I got bumped from the chat and had to log on another spelling.
dr.j (ID=12) (Oct 16, 2001 9:46:59 AM)
Anna, did anyone ever use a term or diagnosis of "aphasia" or dysphasia" for your problem?
dr.j (ID=12) (Oct 16, 2001 9:47:43 AM)
Mari, wait until MARY is removed, highlight your name and go to settings and change to Mary. Happened to me so I had to come in as dr.j2 for a while.
Mari (ID=14) (Oct 16, 2001 9:48:10 AM)
Thank you! I have a question I am going to post to the list that I have never seen addressed. Has to do with academics and CAPD and related issues.
anna (ID=6) (Oct 16, 2001 9:48:19 AM)
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dr.j (ID=12) (Oct 16, 2001 9:48:31 AM)
Sure. please ask.
anna (ID=15) (Oct 16, 2001 9:49:06 AM)
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Mari (ID=14) (Oct 16, 2001 9:49:08 AM)
My son is in 3rd grade, APD, sensory issues and comprehension difficulties. Our school is REALLY intense--they use 6 grade books in the 4th grade.
dr.j (ID=12) (Oct 16, 2001 9:49:46 AM)
Hello again anna. Were you "bumped out" also? Sorry
Mari (ID=14) (Oct 16, 2001 9:49:54 AM)
For LD kids, they substitute another, easier to read book. However, the breadth of knowledge contained in the LD book is vastly less than the content in the regular book.
anna (ID=15) (Oct 16, 2001 9:50:35 AM)
the first, yes. the second, i'll have to look it up.
Mari (ID=14) (Oct 16, 2001 9:50:43 AM)
Consequently, the LD kids don't get as much knowledge in the easier text--it's really "dummied down" even though these kids may have the ability to learn so much more.
Mari (ID=14) (Oct 16, 2001 9:51:49 AM)
This kind of teaching will clearly effect overall intelligence, and i.q. scores as they age. My question is, does anyone know of a really good textbook series that is easier to read, but doesn't skimp so much on content.
anna (ID=15) (Oct 16, 2001 9:52:51 AM)
yes, will do.......i don't yet know how to use the chat system here.
Mari (ID=14) (Oct 16, 2001 9:53:01 AM)
These are bright kids with LD issues--clearly normal i.q.s--at this point. I have seen older (junior high) kids who have used this series (LD books) and they have not received the knowledge they should have received in earlier years.
dr.j (ID=12) (Oct 16, 2001 9:53:06 AM)
Anna, we can talk more, need more time. Please email me and ask me to discuss APHASIA further with you. I have had much experience with people who have had aphasia and auditory receptive problems. I will happily share my info with you and help you better understand your auditory problems. ALso, I HAVE worked in counseling and providing short term treatment help for people with auditory problems related to aphasia.
anna (ID=15) (Oct 16, 2001 9:54:17 AM)
thank you so much, dr. j! will do.
Mari (ID=14) (Oct 16, 2001 9:54:30 AM)
I feel these kids can learn just about anything, but "modified" curriculum, in my opinion, should not mean "deleted." Anyone have any thoughts or run into this issue?
dr.j (ID=12) (Oct 16, 2001 9:54:59 AM)
Mary, your best bet on checking on a textbook series easier to read but same content is to check with someone who specializes in reading. I don't specialize in reading. However, what you CAN and should do is supplement the text book with other forms of material that provide the same information level as what the other kids get.........
Mari (ID=14) (Oct 16, 2001 9:58:11 AM)
This, unfortunately, then becomes the parent's job to monitor what is being supplemented. The parent then needs to daily review what has been taught, compare to what the general curriculum is, and then supplement. Should we are parents, expect the school to do this--we do have an LD department--or is this what, in a real world, parents should be expected to do? Are there "educational consultants" who can come into a school, and show the LD teachers how to supplemtn?
dr.j (ID=12) (Oct 16, 2001 9:58:41 AM)
Yes, I agree these kids CAN learn if we modify. AND dumbing down the cirriculum is NOT an appropriate education. You could easily argue with the school "separate but NOT equal." The focus of ADA (section 504) b ut better is the IDEA is the education must be equal (free and APPROPRIATE) but equal to that of the other children having the SAME MENTAL CAPACITY. ALso, dumbing down a cirriculum will NOT affect IQ in any way. It only affects information, not knowledge. (Knowledge I define as abilities and skills while informaiton is book information. Example would be a person who knows ALL the words in the dictionary (information) but can't use ANY words to put together a sentence other than very simple sentences (has limited expressive language knowledge). This is NOT a person (such as in ANNA's case) who has a disability in putting together sentences I hope you understand what I mean/
dr.j (ID=12) (Oct 16, 2001 10:00:13 AM)
Yeah, Mary, the schools should do it but they don't . We as parents HAVE to be the advocates and monitor what is going on. Perhaps, if we can show the schools what is going on, and if the schools are proactive and cooperative, they WILL agree to do the monitoring for us.
dr.j (ID=12) (Oct 16, 2001 10:00:37 AM)
Example, many kids with LD and especially with APD learn best with multisensory learning.
dr.j (ID=12) (Oct 16, 2001 10:01:47 AM)
They can learn a great deal (like history) from watching a movie, but can't get it from reading a book. SO, if the goal is to teach the information, then what is wrong with having them watch the video or seeing a movie or checking out a website.....etc.
Mari (ID=14) (Oct 16, 2001 10:02:29 AM)
I think I will post this question to the list regarding a good textbook series that someone may be acquainted with. I totally agree with the multisensory approach--we are Lindamood grads and continuing ed students with them--but frankly, I detect some real laziness on the part of the LD staff who have "always used these LD books" and really don't want to start revamping the curriculum that they have always used with the LD kids.
dr.j (ID=12) (Oct 16, 2001 10:02:31 AM)
Best example, my kids probably know more basic information about history from DIsney movies and going to museums and seeing other movies/videos than from reading....
dr.j (ID=12) (Oct 16, 2001 10:03:19 AM)
I hate to agree but I agree with you wholeheartedly. Now leaving my role as a professional and entering my role as parent.....
Mari (ID=14) (Oct 16, 2001 10:03:34 AM)
Absolutely--videos, field trips, etc., all provide such visuals to our children with different learning styles.
dr.j (ID=12) (Oct 16, 2001 10:04:53 AM)
My wife and I having a special needs child have enrolled him in "regular education" kindergarten this year with a special ed./socialization skills after school program. Our goal as we say is that school provides the social skills, working in groups skills, learning to follow directions, etc. skills needed for everyday life/survival. WE will provide much of the academic skills our child needs at home and he will bring those to school.
Mari (ID=14) (Oct 16, 2001 10:05:40 AM)
We did similarly with our son in kindergarten, first and second grade.
dr.j (ID=12) (Oct 16, 2001 10:06:04 AM)
I have to say that visiting Williamsburg (or berg or burgh) VA is in many ways a better way for kids to really understand what it was like in colonial America far more of an impact than reading 10 books.
Mari (ID=14) (Oct 16, 2001 10:08:52 AM)
It's just when they are older, and the curriculum gets more demanding, I frankly do not see why our kids cannot have almost exactly the same content presented in more concrete ways. It's fine to pitch a textbook that is truly too difficult to read--nothing will be gained by forcing a child with comprehension problems to read it. But certainly the ideas contained can be presented--and tested up--in visual ways.
dr.j (ID=12) (Oct 16, 2001 10:10:09 AM)
Mary I agree and there have to be books (even if it's not text books but reading books) that provide the same concepts or the basic information in easier to read format.
Mari (ID=14) (Oct 16, 2001 10:10:13 AM)
There must be textbooks that are geared to different abilities. I cannot believe that these big textbook companies have "one" LD type of book, that is supposed to be appropriate for everyone.
Mari (ID=14) (Oct 16, 2001 10:10:36 AM)
I cannot believe that these companies wouldn't cash in on the opportunity to sell more books!
Mari (ID=14) (Oct 16, 2001 10:11:24 AM)
Well, I will post to the list, the parents on this list offer such great resouces I will bet that someone has encountered this problem and knows of some great series.
dr.j (ID=12) (Oct 16, 2001 10:11:35 AM)
What you may want is to institute a strategy called "pre-teaching" with your child in school. In this strategy, the vocabulary, basic concepts, etc. of the REAL lesson are taught prior to the lesson taught in regular ed. class, then the child goes to the reg. ed class and learns what the other kids learn (or at least hears what the other kids hear fro mthe teacher).
dr.j (ID=12) (Oct 16, 2001 10:12:43 AM)
I don't mean to sound negative, but it's 10:10 and I have to sign off AT 10:15 as I have an appointment elsewhere from where I am at 10:30 (appt. is about 10 minutes away).
Mari (ID=14) (Oct 16, 2001 10:12:53 AM)
This is supposed to be done anyway--written into just about every IEP in my school. The reality is, that the LD teachers may be pre-teaching just the info in these simpler texts. Thank you for your help! Goodbye.
Mari (ID=14) (Oct 16, 2001 10:13:03 AM)
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Mary (ID=13) (Oct 16, 2001 10:13:17 AM)
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anna (ID=15) (Oct 16, 2001 10:13:57 AM)
thank you dr. j! have pleasant day!
dr.j (ID=12) (Oct 16, 2001 10:14:43 AM)
Anna, I hope we can stay in touch. Please email me and we can share that way. ANd if you do feel you want to come to DC for an appt. let me know and we can arrange for that as well. It was really nice talking with you this am and I am happy to help you in whatever way I can.
anna (ID=15) (Oct 16, 2001 10:14:53 AM)
bye. i'll be emailing you soon......
dr.j (ID=12) (Oct 16, 2001 10:14:58 AM)
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anna (ID=15) (Oct 16, 2001 10:15:01 AM)
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